/warp casino discussion thread

Discussion in 'Discussion' started by Krissy, Aug 9, 2021.

  1. KhalDrogo
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    KhalDrogo Well-Known Member

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    I'm chatting with someone in game that is running a casino containing a "Yellow Vote Key"
    They don't advertise the odds but if you ask, they tell you it is 4.5 million to one but someone will 100% win it!

    So on average, someone has to spend 4.5 million grass to win this supposed "yellow vote key" I don't even think there is that much grass on the server.

    This prize is not likely to be won! How are the moderators dealing with stuff like this.
    Krissy, are you able to provide some input on this?


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  2. Boarder
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    Boarder Active Member

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    If it`s rlly 1/45 000 000 it should be considered a scam because it`s most likely never to be won.
     
  3. KhalDrogo
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    KhalDrogo Well-Known Member

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    Especially when they say there is a 100% chance that someone will win it. Highly unlikely and definately no certainty.

    I can see chaos coming with all these new casino popping up. Unless there are moderators almost full time checking them.
     
  4. bERYbERRY
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    bERYbERRY gregory sus Builder Premium

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    Cant wait to play casinoblock!
     
  5. archerexpert777
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    archerexpert777 Senior Member

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    "They were never made as a tutorial and are not supposed to be" hmm yes let me get my underage minecraft a** onto '/warp info. sees casino tutorial OMG i wanna make one like that and maybe tweak the basic design so its my own and I may screw up the mechanics while giving sh** prizes :D

    I hope you can get where im going here man lol. While I agree the warp is a great thing maybe not showing a basic casino with the mechanisms isn't a great idea as young players can easily mess it up. Providing an explanation how player casinos work, what rights you are legally bound and where the line is crossed is a better alternative.

    man why don't you marry me already

    Jokes aside, I find it sad and funny the staff team decided it was a great thing to create the warp and not let actual experts work with them as well as well-known casino owners (like me :) ). We have more experience with dealing with casinos and how to operate one versus most of the staff team who likely haven't
    bro you make me cringe every time I see you respond. I don't see any value you add other than giving some people a tumor in their eyes to see your cringe posts
     
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  6. Emerald
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    Emerald Experienced Member

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    I can confirm that it is 4.5 million odds as I was in the process of talking to the builders during its construction. I do understand that a yellow key is obviously going to in the very high ends of odds, but even odds such as 1 million seem near impossible, let alone 1 million x 4 times. The casino shown only has a Yellow V-key prize and no other prizes attached, so I do understand how some players can see this as a "scam".

    Getting back on topic with the actual warp, due to the "/warp casino" command being removed, it does take away some of the promotions for casinos in general for the server. I've seen a lot of points be brought up with the difference of in-game currency gambling vs. real-life gambling, and I do have to say in my opinion they aren't too far apart of being similar. You are able to purchase in-game currency with real-life currency, and you are able to gamble with that. I can repeat that again, but you are able to gamble with in-real life currency on the server in a way yes. In a way, I do understand all of KhalDrogo's points when he brings up the promotion of casinos on a server where the community is mainly children, and that these machines should be left as "player built redstone machines", as they are under the full impression of a "casino" and gambling currently.

    The removal of the warp though, is not the solution to all of these concerns. The entire casino build still exists in /warp info, you just cannot directly teleport to the using /warp to the casino portion. There are still and going to be players creating faulty machines, their casinos breaking, items in odds that should not belong, and the list could continue. I do have to agree with the ideology that the experienced redstone casino creators should have been left to build these casinos for any player, while making some profit on top of that due to their abilities. This would almost 100% guarantee trustable casinos from almost every player, and there is usually a sign stating who built the casino, usually from an experienced redstone builder. The players who build these machines for other players though, do provide all information on how to run the casino, how to stock the grass and take out your profits in the chest, how you should run your odds, what items belong in what odds, etc. Without this basic information at /warp info, it does create a bunch of unnecessary problems and increases the chances of more scams going around the server.

    Some of the casinos I have been to so far, have followed the exact design of /warp casino. The prizes in their odds did not match other casinos, and in my opinion could be considered a scam. I do have to agree with the removal of /warp casino, but if the build is going to remain, I do believe all of the proper information to run and work a casino should be provided. However, the intentions of this build were an "example" and not a "tutorial", however the entire redstone build and the signs on the droppers do contradict that idea, and I would consider it a tutorial. If a player is asking how do I build a casino, they are going to be redirected to /warp info and to go to the casino portion of the warp to understand how to build a simple casino design. Previously, a player asking that question would get told that an experienced casino builder would be able to build a design for that player for grass, which also gave a way for these builders to make grass currency for their abilities and contributions in-game.

    So overall, the /warp casino removal was a start and was a good way to shift the promotions of casinos for the server, but there are still some issues that lay with this build still currently. Personally, a full removal of the build or addition to information on casinos, would properly suite this build more efficiently.
     
  7. LeoSteel
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    LeoSteel Active Member

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    Trying to herd the thread back to the point so staff can actually think about action rather than essay reading. The majority of the people commenting are NOT happy with this section of /warp info in its current state.

    The majority of people feel that you should remove some of the specifics to dissolve its current look as a tutorial. And a lot of people feel more rounded information about gambling should be in place at the warp to inform players of the responsibilities of gambling.

    A few players feel the need to remove the section altogether, which is fine to believe, but the reasoning has been diluted through EULA and Moral debates.

    Personally I think the warp is fine to stay, but should not contain the tutorial information it currently has, and an information board should be added to explain casino uses and good practices.
     
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  8. Xstevey
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    Xstevey Member

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    Tbh, im starting to think the only person who ever has a problem with me is you. There's nothing wrong with getting off topic once or twice. Pretty much every time you reply to any message of mine is just you telling me im cringe. Just get over it man, I get that I make you cringe what do you want me to do? Just stop talking? Im sorry but I'd rather not. The best option here is for you just to not read my posts.
     
  9. Krissy
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    Krissy hyyh Super Moderator Discord Administrator Premium Premium

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    I do not wish to involve myself in controversial discussions however since I facilitated the conversations to an extent I will leave something.

    All changes to the server need to be approved by the owner. Mods can put forth ideas and have opinions just like the rest of the community. Our trusted position with the owner may allow us to work on projects or report issues easier as you would expect of any company who has employees. Moderator responsibility is to enforce server rules, help people and the effect of this is that the server experience "improves".Higher staff ensure the server is fun, well maintained and safe. Mods are being held to a standard that is either too high for our roles or so low that people think it is appropriate to belittle, disrespect and insult us.

    We do not approve of the idea that players gatekeep what other people do. New players have as much of a right to build as long time players. Denying players of common gameplay mechanic knowledge that assists them in the entry of the economy is unfair and inconsiderate.

    In terms of how these relate to this discussion I will explain.

    The Casino warp itself
    After visiting the warp (I was not part of the build due to life) it was very hard to understand how I could replicate the design apart from using schematica. I can see new players finding it challenging and might make a mistake building it. However likewise new players might see these advertisements in chat and end up going on YouTube to find a design that won't work either. Furthermore new players don't have the same materials to create a casino so it wouldn't be enticing for most people meaning they likely wouldn't be successful and from reports and punishments there hasn't been an alarming number of scams or complaints. Yes, there is always things that happen that we don't see. However the worst case scenario is that so many new people will join, visit the warp, make a casino then scam people because they built it wrong which is quite a stretch given what we have seen over the years.

    Instead of presenting solutions to help there were complaints instead. Most people who complained wanted the warp gone as the solution however that was not going to be the case as the owner said. Upon knowing this there was still a very heavy debate. To the people who presented solutions rather than critiques I would like to thank you. It has become common lately to use situations like these to critique with underlaying insults and criticisms rather than to promote change.

    The economy

    I won't spend too long on this topic. The economy won't be ruined because of extra casinos from new players who are quite powerless in terms of this economy. Plus remember they don't have the means to maintain a casino. A casino's rep is based on the owner of it and not on a small group of new players who decide to build one. Let people participate in the economy.

    Too many Casinos?
    Based on what we have seen so far there are already a lot of people trying their hand in making a casino. The hook for the casino isn't just because you have one, but the prizes you offer. So again to reiterate new players will likely not have a good chance to create a successful casino as they don't have the prizes that will entice people to spend. You guys are not going to find yourself broke because of the warp

    The solution
    I touched on users that gave solutions so here is where we stand, correct as of this post. Noobcrew has no intentions of removing the warp or outlawing casinos. Therefore we are going to work with what we have. Suggestions that have a strong chance of being implemented are changes to the signage at the warp; ensuring people are aware of the risks of gambling and risk of scams. Other suggestions need more discussion.

    But what do I think of Skyblock Casinos?
    Gambling games have been around since classic in various forms. Simple roulettes could be made with rails, even I ran a guessing game almost like deal or no deal that cost money to join. But it was all in good fun. When casinos became a part of Skyblock I didn't really vibe with them anymore. People were very intent on making profits with them and they were no longer accessible to everyone because of their complexity. Then players wanted more regulation on them and I don't know about other staff but most of us weren't redstone experts to understand what was a scam and brought in players help.
    I do think casinos ruin the vibe of Skyblock somewhat. The server used to be more diverse than just shops, casinos and mapart. I miss those times.

    What now?
    I think it is time that we stop and understand each other more rather than argue so people think we are right. We also need to start understanding that Skyblock isn't going to change into what your ideal sever looks like. The whole issue with the thread is the issue was so small yet the reaction we too extreme. What could have been resolved kindly was drawn on with high levels of hostility, disrespect and arguments.

    I can't speak for every staff member but at least on my part I'm pretty sick and tired of being professional and kind only to be blamed and insulted for things out of our control and sick of being polite to who ignores their self awareness to propagate hate. At least the first part I've tried to address. The second part likely will never change.

    It is easy to sit and complain and pick out faults and be a smart a** about things on the server but far more difficult to implement changes without some group having an issue. I have a few examples of where doing the "right" thing that players want will open up more issues. I'll do my best to be transparent so you know why things are the way they are.

    If you want a tl;dr it would be this
    To make meaningful change to the server everyone must be willing to present problems with solutions and do so in a manner which isn't used to insult or hurt other people. It should always be about the issue, not who the issue is. Just remember that for next time.

    Thank you again for people that helped with potential solutions and we will see what will happen next.
     
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  10. Novembree
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    Novembree Moderator Moderator

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    Thank you Krissy. I would like to add that the casino area at warp info has had some updates.
     
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  11. Ca1
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    Ca1 Senior Member

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    Why did you decide to teach players how casinos function? You did not do with map art islands, spawner farms, stone generators, mob farms, ETC! This making it seem like server wants you to make a casino rather than these other money making methods!
     
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  12. KhalDrogo
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    KhalDrogo Well-Known Member

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    My question exactly. This server could be so much more. It used to be.
    Drogo is disappointed that casinos seem to be the main feature on this server now.
     
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  13. Boarder
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    Boarder Active Member

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    To be fair here, casinos are by far the most profitable way to make grass. And stone gens, spawnersy mob farms etc. are rather easy to make. I`d do love to see a mapart tutorial actually, but given the fact that you need a perfectly centered island its not suitable for every player and kinda unfair since its RNG (if I`m not mistaken).

    Nevertheless, its heartbreaking to see that skyblock seems to only be about casinos nowadays. We definitely need new content!
     
  14. KhalDrogo
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    KhalDrogo Well-Known Member

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    Unlike stone gens and map art, casinos don’t really add t0 the server in that nothing new is created. They just act to distribute grass and items, most often, in the direction of those who run them.
    You say they are profitable, but for every grass gained, someone else loses that grass.
    Drogo views casinos more as a way for people to sell items at inflated prices.
     

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