/warp casino discussion thread

Discussion in 'Discussion' started by Krissy, Aug 9, 2021.

  1. LeoSteel
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    LeoSteel Active Member

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    I do feel that with the addition of the casino examples at a public information warp, it felt like they were there as a tutorial for players to follow to build 3 different casinos. I didn't see it as just plain examples of casinos because whats the point in that, what I believe would have been better is an information section warning players about casino usage and how gambling doesn't always mean winning. And that they should choose carefully which casinos to gamble at, if they choose to gamble at all.

    There isn't a single piece of information there, that gambling is at your own risk and that you shouldn't gamble with anything you can't afford/don't want to lose. It could have been more educational/informative, rather than literally a tutorial.
     
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  2. KhalDrogo
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    KhalDrogo Well-Known Member

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    Drogo agrees, however adding warnings about gambling could be seen as an understanding that it is wrong in a kids game. If it needs a warning, don't expose kids to it.

    The announcement post originally said "learn how to make them", in reference to the casino's. It has since been changed to say "learn how one might look" so Drogo did believe they were meant as a tutorial, but will take Novembree's word that they weren't.

    Some might think that Drogo is trying to cause trouble but it's quite the opposite. Drogo is wanting to avoid it because no real trouble can come from him, but it can come from Microsoft.
    Gambling among kids is a real issue so much so that it is specifically mentioned in the commercial usage guidelines.
    Not too long ago, gambling in kids games was in the news.

    Personally, Drogo thinks it's pretty risky to allow it as it is.
     
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  3. Sky
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    They were never made as a tutorial and are not supposed to be. They are there to show that they are more than just the three droppers in front not knowing what's going on behind. The three examples at warp casino at warp info are there to show players that they can be made and that they are a feature in this server that the players created years ago. Casinos are always a play at your own risk kind of game, and if you know what one is then you know that you aren't going to win 100% of the time. If you do not know what a casino is, then you shouldn't play one.
     
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  4. KhalDrogo
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    KhalDrogo Well-Known Member

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    The post originally said “learn how to make them” so you can see how that would have seemed.
     
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  5. LeoSteel
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    LeoSteel Active Member

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    Certain information that has been displayed on the signs are entirely not required if this is just "examples". Why is the contents of each dropper described if their purpose is just to "show what a casino looks like". None of the information you just listed there is at the actual warp to tell the new players that "Casinos are always a play at your own risk kind of game" and "you aren't going to win 100% of the time". The only information given at warp casino is what goes in to making a casino. Hence it *looking* like a tutorial not an information area.
     
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  6. boba
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    boba Experienced Member

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    debating whether to make a casino or not now.. :sobbing::sobbing::sobbing::sobbing::sobbing::sobbing::sobbing::sobbing::sobbing:
     
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  7. Emerald
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    Emerald Experienced Member

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    Personally, I did not see any issues with the casino placements in /warp info. My overall concern was sending a pdf of changes/updates to the team a few weeks back for an entire update on /warp info and my 4 of my overall displays with all the signs from the previous warp info being used in the new /warp info using my exact words without knowledge, permission, or any credit, but it seems as though my signs are being removed which is good and there has been an edit in this thread giving past contributors credit.

    Over the period of time however, I do have to agree with KhalDrogo's point on the casino. It does say in the EULA, [​IMG]

    I would consider these player built redstone machines, however a warp with the the word "casinos" with the redstone designs and sign placements telling you on how to create a casino, could be seen as advertising the use of casinos for the server. In my personal opinion, the builds of the casinos are fine to stay, but I personally would not have it under a warp called /warp casino as it could come across as promotion. As far as I know, the very popular Minecraft servers do not allow casinos as it promotes gambling and/or does not comply with the EULA and by a simple Google search it seems as though almost no servers allowed casinos.

    I also do see points coming across of the economy being ruined, although I do not seeing that happening at such a fast pace, it is very possible. Casino usage also gives any new Skyblock player the ability to create one just from the warp, but the warp shows no information about chances, odds, how to stock the chest, what value of items should go into what odds, etc. What made casinos very unique, is that every player did not have one on their island, as there was a range of player casinos to go to, which kept them in buisness. If a majority of the player base has casinos, there wouldn't be as many people playing these casinos from other players, and would become more concern on their own casino. This could encourage a lot of more casino scams and even casinos breaking, with the player having no knowledge on how to fix such issues or what item should go into the 1/81 lets say. Whoever wanted to have a casino on their island, did have the grass to pay for one to be built and was on the server long enough to understand how a casino functions. While I'm personally not saying to remove the warp or such, it does seem to be of more of a tutorial than just the example of just the design.

    If the warp was meant to be a tutorial, it would be very useful to include signs warning players about casinos and such, and giving additional information on everything as it seems to be very limited at the time, but there seems to be a lot going into play for this, and this is just my opinion.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2022
  8. Krissy
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    Krissy hyyh Super Moderator Discord Administrator Premium Premium

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    This thread is to discuss the new warp casino as there was quite a few complaints and issues brought up. All discussion from the news thread is moved to here which is the proper section for server related discussion.

    Thank you for your cooperation.
     
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  9. Friesaustin
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    Friesaustin Member

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    To put it short and simple, this new warp is RUINING my main source of income. I know I might sound selfish and you don't care, but it's not just me, it's true for many people.Basically anyone that owns a casino is ruined. You might ask why? Well, first of all, new players such as greenies might make a casino with 1/81 chance for like a wood block or stick, creating competition and bad reputation for casinos. let me repeat, creating competition and bad reputation. I know many of you own casinos and know how these two things might affect your profits from your casino.
    Let me explain why, for example, a new player spends tons of grass (maybe from like a dp) on a terrible casino, they won 3 stacks of sticks and 2.5 stacks of wood blocks. This new player now has a very bad perception of the game and quit, affecting not only other casino owners, but also the server. This is just one example of it, if i wanted to, I could go on and on and on on this topic, but to keep it short and simple, I strongly disagree from this warp.
     
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    Last edited: May 25, 2022
  10. Ca1
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    Ca1 Senior Member

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    Hello, your casino and all the 100s of newgens making casinos have terrible odds and already ruined the reputation of casinos.
    Thanks! :D
     
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  11. Boarder
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    Boarder Active Member

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    Gotta disagree on this one in some aspects. 1. My buisness isnt ruined by this, also if someone gets 100% of his grass from one specific buisness theres always a risk. 2. I believe people should know how casinos work and how to build one, it's just fair imo. Though the creators of the designs should have been mentioned (at least)
     
  12. UrsusMaiorus
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    UrsusMaiorus Well-Known Member

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    people spend a lot of time designing casinos. people shouldn't be able to copy paste from a tutorial. if the casino warp explains how Redstone works without showing how to do it I like that. Building and running a casino should require some smarts to make not just skem copy paste. I paid grep for my casinos because he is smart at that i could have just copy pasted from the new warp. A Redstone machine is not common since and shouldn't be displayed that would be like showing someone's old pumpkin farm on eco without their permission or something like that. U should not run a casino if you don't understand how they work. and if u can just copy and paste people who don't know will run them.
     
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  13. HeroDJBrine
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    HeroDJBrine Active Member

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    I've already spoken to a mod about this, but my main point is the encouragement of building faulty casinos by new players. This will almost certainly result in scamming, and more problems.

    My solution:
    Either remove /warp casino ENTIRELY, or to cover up the redstone to not encourage faulty casinos. However if for some reason showing vague redstone is so neccesary, make a full tutorial of making the casinos. I know the warp is made to display examples, if so then do what it is intended to do: display, not tutor.

    There may be people who disagree with a casino tutorial, which I understand why. However it is still better than a tutorial for faulty casinos.
     
  14. Dexuby
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    Dexuby Developer and Forums Administrator Forums Administrator Developer

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    If that's the case you shouldn't be too worried, when Mojang started to enforce the EULA a few years ago multiple servers I worked with got asked to remove or change certain things, not once did they mention in-game gambling mechanics like coin flipping, loot boxes, NPC fights that you can bet on or slot machines. They also warn you and give you plenty of time to implement the changes they request before they actually do something.
    That's not true, most/nearly all of the popular servers have gambling mechanics. Just one example would be a pretty popular server with around 6000 concurrent players that has Casino NPCs at their spawn which allow you to gamble in a variety of ways. A lot of servers even sell loot boxes for real money which is also a form of gambling if you want to be accurate.

    I personally don't really care if /warp casino exists or not, just wanted to clarify some things.
     
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  15. KhalDrogo
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    KhalDrogo Well-Known Member

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    It will be interesting to see if Microsoft enforce their EULA better than Mojang have.
    Personally, I really hate the idea of exposing children to gambling at all. Many studies have shown the negative effect of it in computer games and Skyblock is now full of them.
    Whether it's enforced or not, it's specifically mentioned in the EULA so it shouldn't be in game. It's a matter of ethics really. Is it ok to disregard rules and laws, just because they aren't being enforced?

    You are totally accurate on that. And this one sells "Lucky Crate Keys" which are also gambling.
    Noobcrew has stated that it was the "community" that introduced casinos to the server. Gambling in the form of the crate keys has been there for as long as I can remember.
    As has the 'server built' casino at Economy's spawn! Quite likely the first casino.
    The community didn't introduce them to the server. The seed has always been there.
     
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    Last edited: May 25, 2022
  16. Dexuby
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    Dexuby Developer and Forums Administrator Forums Administrator Developer

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    Since they don't really explain how they mean it (no details & examples) it's possible that they have no problem with such in-game mechanics. I also doubt that Microsoft will do much different considering that after they bought Mojang the EULA got changed again allowing servers to sell benefits & items as long as the server isn't PvP focused/competitive. What you are bringing up now is a moral thing and has nothing to do with the EULA, you initially made it sound like your main concern is that Mojang will have a problem with this but this is most likely not the case and if so they'll let us know. As mentioned pretty much every server has some form of gambling (loot boxes being the most common one).
     
  17. KhalDrogo
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    KhalDrogo Well-Known Member

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    Yes, my thoughts/morals on the subject are not linked to the EULA but similar thoughts were no doubt considered when they wrote it.

    And I agree with you that many servers have an element of gambling, which is to say that many servers violate the EULA. I guess, I just preferred this server when it didn’t.
     
  18. Dexuby
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    Dexuby Developer and Forums Administrator Forums Administrator Developer

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    Gambling already existed before this warp got created, like you said the economy spawn has a few casinos and crates are a thing. I get that you are concerned but I personally doubt that this warp will change a lot since it doesn't introduce a new gambling concept, it just explains an existing, community made, concept. If you don't like the idea you can obviously say it & suggest the removal of the warp.
     
  19. Emerald
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    Emerald Experienced Member

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    Personally in my opinion, crates are not “gambling” as you are always guaranteed a reward no matter what. Most servers do have crates yes, but they are mainly cosmetic based so they do not fall under the line of pay to win for crates, but this thread is more about the casinos. These actual player built machines, which the server calls a casino, could be seen by some players as a form and or promotion of gambling for minors, and when researching this topic I did come across quite a few popular, or very unpopular servers that did not allow casinos due to the message it was sending, and EULA break. I would still consider this machine a player built red stone machine, if it was not labeled as a casino from the warp. From what I’ve seen, Mojang has not been putting in as much effort to take these servers down, but according to the EULA the same rules still apply.

    While I personally may or may not agree with this view, this is just some of my opinion and some information I gathered online. It is not too much as a concerned to me, as I am a little more concerned on how the warp has no information displayed regarding the risks and guidelines and such, but I do see all opinions when it comes to this topic
     
  20. KhalDrogo
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    KhalDrogo Well-Known Member

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    I agree that the warp won’t likely change anything.
    I’ve always opposed casinos on the server. Not been overly vocal on it really but was quite surprised to see the server take an active roll in promoting their use.


    Crates are most definitely a form of gambling. Many of the rewards are worth less than the money spent so a loss has occurred.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2022

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