Most are aware of the new popular farm in SB, ore generators, which are not only famous for how many people use them but also infamous for the lag they generate.

They are simply an issue, their impact to the economy has very little relevance, but the effect on the gameplay over every single player, lowering the TPS, has been enormous.
My suggestion is to nerf them in a way where they aren't optimal anymore, if possible, while keeping them existing.

I believe the best options to achieve this, in order, are as follows:

• Legalize Nuker

Simple powercreep would phase ore generators out, the impact on the economy would be pretty much the same ore gens already have, but it may affect items like wood. Can be further adjusted by limiting ore rates. I think it's a fair compromise, since it's already a necessity to use mods to have other "meta" setups and it's not more broken than withers/TNT in vanilla. Keeps ore gens existing, so existing users would react better than other options.

• Make moss spread to ores

Elegant, follows the original design of moss (never intended to be used as filter in gens), simple to implement and explain, 100% solves the issue, doesn't affect the market, actually helps moss while nerfing ore gens, feels like something the dev team would do, etc., etc.
An excellent option in my opinion, but maybe too harsh on existing users of ore gens.

• Give them the flying machine treatment

Illegal but possible. A mess to police, confusing to new players, harsh on existing users, the worst of both worlds.

• Adjust piston limit

Would make everyone pay for a few, affects so much stuff I can't even list it, would still be possible to make smaller ore gens. I don't think anyone would love this one TBH.

Moss spreading to stone should not be affected in any way since it's by far one of the main items used by new players, and it would take a heavy toll on the most vulnerable segment of our community, it would be deeply hostile towards the players that help the server grow.

I truly think that swift actions have to be taken in this topic, since the situation is being talked constantly and the state ore gens generate diminish the gameplay to many, if not all, players.

Thanks for taking the time to read my suggestion, I hope you support it and/or leave some feedback below.

 

Are we positive that it is Ore Gens causing the drop in TPS?

 

I support the sentiment that ore generators are creating a lot of lag and something should be done, but I don't think any of your potential solutions are elegant or viable.

It would require some investigating on the devs part, but I believe the lag likely comes from the water flushing the moss foliage rather than the piston events. If this is found to be the case, a harsher water limit could be a potential solution.

 

I don't see how moss spreading to ores would keep the issue around, ore generators as they exist would be litterally impossible and return to a 1.12 state.

Most solutions for this situation require some kind of Dev work, that's expected. But adding ores to the list moss spreads to would be minuscule compared to most other task they do.

Ore gens are a combination of multiple sources of lag, the water updates being the main one, but still, that doesn't make the lag generated by pistons or entities irrelevant when ore gens specifically always includes all of them and are being build by the dozen. Limiting water updates is the same as pistons, affects most markets, now including mapart, for a few causing the issue.

 

idk, feel that ore gens aren't really the cause of the lag, as I've been on islands that are very laggy with no ore gen, while my island has 3 ore gens and no lag...

maybe convince some people to swap chests w barrells?

 

I'm supportive of reducing lag from ore gens, but I'm not familiar with their design so will refrain from supporting a specific nerf for now.

 

Mods have tools to confirm the source of the lag, they can fact check that.

 

Semi agree, although I haven't noticed much lag, others have so maybe removing the moss/seeds and stuff that drops after the bonemeal? can't think of any viable solutions other than a straight up ban on the ore gens, which would really hurt the economy

 

How would it hurt the economy?

 

Iron prices and also lapis prices


If it aint broke dont fix it

 

Iron prices are almost not affected by generators, they generate a very small amount when compared to kits and crates, I am currently making 120 daily iron from my kits alone, thats 1 player and not counting crates. Iron price DIDN'T lower after the creation of ore gens, it has fluctuated around the same value for years now.

Lapis is not a relevant item for the economy and it's mostly used as a building block by a few late-game players, that will buy it regardless of a slight price increase. Very very few is required for enchanting in a server with /enchant.

It IS broke, they are literally breaking the server's TPS.

 

kits? how more then one?

Also, what about the players who spent stacks and stacks of grass to invest in ore gens? Do we just say screw them because a couple of people notices a slight lag?

I don't think this is a good idea, I play on an old pc and notice less lag than hypixel

 

yeah, 120 daily from kits alone, idk what you don't understand, my setup is far from the best one.

Things like this have been nerfed before, quartz rate being the most notorious example, things causing grave issues, especially things like lag, HAVE to be solved one way or another eventually. In this case, most solutions will make that investment lost indeed. I do think it should be avoided if possible, and it's a big point in my suggestion, but if it comes to it i'm sorry.

Stacks of grass can be a lot of time and work, but believe me, I've seen way worse financial looses happen to players, enormous amounts of grass, and they solved it. In this game you always have what you started with and have a fair shot of making it big!

And the plan is for the least amount of people to get screwed, because right now, kinda the entire server is.

The lag did increase and as I said, mods can check the source, I've seen countless in chat mention it as an issue, I don't see the point with the Hypixel comparation.

 

i think you've gotten used to playing on low tps, this lag doesnt just effect a couple ppl, it effects the server tps which in turn just makes the server slower. Maybe you dont see significant rubber banding, like traditional lag, but the server itself gets incredibly slowed down(tps) some hours after reset. Right after reset the server moves in 2x speed literally is what it feels like

 

Did a video showing what you mention, pardon my grammar in it

 

Removing vanilla features is inelegant.

Reducing the threshold for the already existing water limit is probably one of the least intensive tasks a dev could do.

That's why I said it would take some investigation instead of just trying out random things. Water updates most likely account for a significant amount of the lag. Depending on how significant the water updates are compared to the rest of the mechanism, in the face of that, item drops and piston pushes could be negligible.

The water limit could be changed over longer periods, like limits per hour. That would target machines constantly flushing all the time while leaving machines which are run once, like mapart clearers, untouched.

 

The ores spawning in the first place isn't vanilla, the machine isn't possible in vanilla. I don't see how we would be removing anything vanilla since ores arent a thing in vanilla skyblock anyways.

I didn't say water limits was less dev intensive, I said it was harshest on the community, since now you're also messing with the mapart market but even doing it over time you affect several farms. This server is mostly a social game, the way this change affects the community and the market is very important. Also, adding ores to the moss spread list is comparable in dev work anyway and only affects ore gens, what's the benefit we get changing water updates in general instead of only something generated by a plugin in the first place?

 

Rip MorayEel if water limit

I think the main source of lag is that the server devotes its entire resources to kicking me the millisecond I try to send more than 1 message in a row

 

I never said anything about water limits being more or less dev intensive? Both are very easy to implement.

Moss spreading to ores is not vanilla.

I mentioned how it wouldn't affect mapart at all if implemented in a certain way.

Massive mob flushing farms that run constantly would also be hit, and they are also a significant contributor to lag.

 

The only new farm that is known to affect the lag is the ore gen, idk why we should affect flushing farms when they are suboptimal and only used by a few early game players in the server. They have always been in the server and never been an issue since spawners are way better.

The issue with ore farms is how many of them they are, new ones are being made every day, and lag wasn't a problem before they became this common.

And thats the thing, some laggy farms are okay if few players need them, flowing water farms aren't an issue since the optimal farms used by titans rarely use it. Only big shops selling all items need to use them for some niche ones, or new players without the means for the better option.

The only farm that needs to be addressed here is ore gens, and making moss spread to ores, you only target that specific model of farm without affecting any other current build that exists, while the water option needs to be tuned around mapart flushers and still will affect other existing machines that aren't nearly as common as the ore gens.

Vanilla is more about the experience, and ore gens are something you just can't experience in vanilla, they simply are not possible. While machines using running water are a part of the experience vanilla offers.

The change I propose, wouldn't be found in normal gameplay, because there would be no reason to be bone mealing near ores in the way we play in this server, you must have to be trying to make an ore gen which is the thing we wanna address, but otherwise, ores are decorative or valuables here, not something you can find in the wild and bone meal accidentally like vanilla, worst case scenario, a player looses an iron ore after a very specific line of gameplay.

Many more players, doing things not related to the issue, would encounter the water change over time, players doing things that have never caused a lag issue. One player already mentioned someone they knew who would be affected, and I know of many more existing builds of active players that would be affected. Builds that exist since a long time without any issue.

In vanilla, every single block coming from a stone gen would turn to moss. It's that simple.