Economy Make water-flushing farms illegal

Discussion in 'Server Gameplay Suggestions' started by Surv, Mar 9, 2022.

  1. Surv
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    Surv Experienced Member

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    If you've been on /economy lately, you'd know that the TPS typically sits around 12-15. A big reason for this is because of water-flushing mob farms. I won't get too in detail on how they cause the lag, but here is a detailed thread by mijiperki [Click here to be directed to miji's post].

    This design has literally been proven by studies to lower TPS. I don't see the downside to making this specific design illegal.
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  2. Awesomolocity
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    Awesomolocity Well-Known Member

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    No brainer. These farms are way larger than necessary to get good drops, and end up negatively impacting everyone else on the server.
     
  3. Ca1
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    Ca1 Senior Member

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    they ban people for it already
     
  4. Surv
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    Surv Experienced Member

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    Not on Economy. Staff has confirmed with me before I posted this that it is just 'advised' against, and is not considered illegal.
     
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  5. Calidre
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    Calidre Experienced Member

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    Actually they do ban on economy for it already, it's not illegal but if a player owns one and a staff is on and tells them to take it down and they don't they have been punished for it

    Also flush farms aren't exactly the issue there is little none of them currently on economy, the problem is the very large amount of water collection systems for crop hoppers. Since they got released a year ago the average tps has slowly decreased over time due to the extensive amount of people that switch from manually selling pumpkins to collecting them via water streams. 1 or 2 or 3 of these on their own don't make a difference, but the combination of all of them running from majority of the people on economy lower TPS. Water updates, though not as laggy when it isn't being placed and replaced, are your main source of lag. When you have 15-20+ of these running all day, it gets worse. TPS is also not just straight forward either 5 or 20, it stacks and overtime slowly grows or gets worse, that's why the server does daily resets so that it can restart the lag issues otherwise this particular server would slowly keep going down overall.

    Basically TL;DR it's not really these farms they barely exist or not at all, and rather the stacking of dozens of collection systems being run 24/7 stacking lag throughout the day
     
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  6. Surv
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    Surv Experienced Member

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    Novembree was online and I double checked with her if they were illegal. She confirmed with me that they aren't an illegal build at the moment, and they're just 'advised against.' I asked staff before making this thread because I've heard other people mentioning how they were illegal, but with Bree's confirmation of them not being illegal I made this thread.

    JAWD's farm has proven to affect TPS by a number of 2.0 at least, and I will be running tests on it once I get the chance. (Yes, I will edit the graphs I create into my original post).
     
  7. Calidre
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    Calidre Experienced Member

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    I just explained they aren't illegal but players have been banned in the past for running them, long before Bree was even staff

    Yes they effect TPS, but they are little to non existent. The combination of all major pumpkin farms running with collection systems running 24/7 affect it just as much and more with constant running water updates
     
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  8. morayeel
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    morayeel Active Member Premium

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    I would like to note that stationary water that isn't updating does not cause any lag.
     
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  9. Calidre
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    Calidre Experienced Member

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    Collection systems aren't stationary water all water involved in a collection system is running
     
  10. Surv
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    Surv Experienced Member

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    Yes, but that is the past, Calidre. I made this thread beacuse currently they are legal and not punished for.

    Secondly, the lag you mention is from water updates. I have yet to see a pumpkin farm that has water updates in farms, but I could be mistaken. The water updates are from the dispensers that are typically found in these water flush farms.

    Running water is different from the water updates we are talking about. The water is never unplaced and then replaced automatically through a redstone clock. Compared to these mob farms where redstone picks up the water, places it, etc.
     
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  11. morayeel
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    morayeel Active Member Premium

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    Even though it is "running" its stream isn't being changed and thus does not create any lag whatsoever. What makes the lag is when its spread keeps changing. Placed water that isn't tampered with, even if flowing, literally does not make any lag.


    Calidre I think you're getting confused by the items that are being moved. Those cause lag, not the water.
     
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  12. Calidre
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    Calidre Experienced Member

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    too tired to come up with an answer atm but tbh most kinds of farms should be legal including these a server of this size shouldn't lag out of existence because of 2 farms just proves how many crap things need to be fixed
     
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  13. Surv
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    Surv Experienced Member

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    I agree with this. But until that is handled, removing this certain design can *help* the TPS. Not entirely fix, as there's many other things causing low TPS, but it will certainly help.
     
  14. Ca1
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    Ca1 Senior Member

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    What? I know a player who got banned for it, please do not make claims unless they are true!

    The rules have not changed a WORD since said player was banned! If a farm is too out of hand the staff team are very able and capable of putting a stop to it! They are not dumb! They are aware when farms lag the server, and they take ACTION against it!
     
  15. Surv
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    Surv Experienced Member

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    You can argue your standpoint with staff. I was notified today (by a staff member) that they are legal.
     
  16. Ca1
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    Ca1 Senior Member

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    Yes. Building a flushing mob 1 layer farm is legal. Why wouldn't it be ? It does nothing to harm the server. Building massive amounts of these farms may do something to the TPS (not proven by you!) and staff take action against this as it is LITERALLY STATED IN THE RULES THAT THIS IS ALREADY ILLEGAL!
     
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  17. Surv
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    Surv Experienced Member

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    1) I never claimed it was proven by me… if you didn’t notice, as I assume you didn’t, I mentioned that Mijiperki proved this theory.

    2) We aren’t discussing a small plain 1 layer farm. We are discussing the design in its entirety, whether that be 1 layer or 50.

    3) Show me the rule where it is said to be illegal. Are you trying to tell me that Novembree is wrong?
     
  18. Ca1
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    Ca1 Senior Member

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    I never claimed you claimed it was proven by you. But since you seemed so caught up on what is in the past and what is current, I'd like to at least think you'd test this for yourself and verify it. Anyone can make claims on anything, does not mean you have to believe it.

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    Rule 3 Code of Conduct, baby. If Novembree said building massive farms in their entirety that lag the server as much as your unverified claims say, then yes, they are wrong.
     
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  19. Surv
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    Surv Experienced Member

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    As mentioned by Bree, the design is technically legal but "can be removed if it disrupts the gameplay of other users"

    You may be missing the whole point of this thread, Ca1. This thread is to make the design in its entirety illegal.
     
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  20. Ca1
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    Ca1 Senior Member

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    I understand that was not on point of the thread just some context and misinformation that needed to be sorted out. I do not think this design needs to be made illegal for it creates no impactful lag when built in standard use cases. And when it DOES start creating lag, which, I assume is your whole reason for suggesting this design's removal from the server, there is already a rule which prevents it from being legal.
     
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