Global Feedback On Future Island Competitions

Discussion in 'Server Gameplay Suggestions' started by OmarsCraft, Mar 1, 2021.

  1. OmarsCraft
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    OmarsCraft Active Member

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    When it comes to the Island Competition that 52Phenomenon host I strongly feel there should be some type of feedback as to why one island won and another didn't.

    Players spend hours upon hours over a span of multiple months making an island for this exact Competition hoping they'd win the medal that all contestants desire. From what I assume is correct, only the Staff Team plays a part in deciding who wins the Island Competition or not. Hate it or not there will always be bias in this type of decision no matter how you look at it. Yes I might be coming off as a salty person who lost the competition to someone else but thats only because I was rejected when I asked why someone else won and I or others didn't. If the Staff Team or 52Phenomenon came out and told the contestants why someone won the competition and they didn't then this could help us figure out what our island is lacking in compared to the island that won so that the other contestants that didn't win have something to work with instead of being puzzled as to why they lost. Yes telling people what they're lacking on their island could hurt other's feelings but at least we won't be left in the dark on what we lack and what we need to work on the most. The fact that others feel this is more of a popularity contest than an island contest shows that there needs to be reasoning behind why an island won. Just how I mentioned in Ca1's Thread on how applicants for Staff strive to be close with Staff Members to better their chances at landing a spot on the Staff Team, Contestants who are closer with Staff Members without a doubt have a better chance at winning an Island Competition than someone who has a better island but doesn't chat with anyone in the community. If Staff gave even a bit of feedback on why someone's island won and another contestant's didn't and shared the process on how Staff picked the winning island then I strongly feel this would clear things up and lessen the amount of people who feel wronged in past and future Island Competitions.

    Feel free to share any comments :p
     
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  2. Frez
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    Frez Shark Super Moderator Premium

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    Island comps are just a bit of fun to get the community to interact and enjoy building. All staff vote on their favourite island and the votes are counted.
    Personally I look at the screenshot presented before reading names.
    Each staff member will judge according to what they like, our general guidelines are:
    islands are judged on how they look, how unique they are, and how well they are built
    Personally, I look for original ideas.
    If you want feedback feel free to DM staff individually, I'm sure they will spare 5 mins. You don't know how close votes are or who votes for what so please do not assume that we all group together because we don't. We all have different tastes and styles.
    Nobody is "wronged" in island competitions. As I've stated, they're just a bit of fun. Nothing is stopping you from entering it again.
    Thankyou.
     
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  3. OmarsCraft
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    OmarsCraft Active Member

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    Oh I've tried asking the reasoning behind why someone won and I was turned down instantly. Pretty sure I was told that the Staff Member couldn't tell me or any other contestants so I just stopped at that Staff Member because I assumed it was the same for the rest :(

    And its great you look at the pictures first before names but whats stopping other Staff Members from being influenced by a popular name or someone their closer to. If there were a feedback section or something of the sort then it could actually show why someone won and what others need to work on :p

    I agree its meant for fun but it isn't fun when someone feels as if they should've won and aren't left with an explanation on why they didn't and another person did. I do agree that someone can reapply but I know some people that don't even want to reapply because they've damn near done all they could to their island from what I can tell and none of Staff wants to give any feedback on what else he can do to give them a better chance to win the next time around.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2021
  4. 52Phenomenon
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    52Phenomenon Super Moderator Super Moderator Events Manager

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    Hi, it’s currently midnight here in the UK and I have to get to sleep for school so if it’s ok I’d like to reply to this in the morning after my work is done so I can do it properly.


    I will say though, why couldn’t you just message me this? I don’t feel like this needed to posted publicly and it comes across like you just want to put me or the competition on blast instead of putting forward a genuine concern. Please correct me, if I am wrong.


    That’s all I have time for now because I must sleep but like I say I’ll be back tomorrow sometime to fully reply.
     
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  5. OmarsCraft
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    OmarsCraft Active Member

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    to be fair it was you that I came to for any kind of feedback but was given nothing but a cold shoulder :(and there are other contestants that I've spoken to that feel the same about this so I thought it would be fine to put this here so they can put any type of input or suggestion to add on to what I've said. This thread wasn't meant to put anyone or anything on blast its just that we contestants are at a loss of words on what we have left to do with our islands that we and many others strongly feel should've won. I apologize if any of this came across the wrong way but I strongly feel any kind of feedback could help us out on what we need to do better our chances at winning something we worked so hard for :sobbing:
     
  6. Krissy
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    Krissy hyyh Administrator Discord Administrator Premium Premium

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    I vote for islands that are not the usual terraformed islands that most people make to enter. While it takes work a lot of islands look quite similar in the way the terraform is. Unique islands always get my vote. Uniqueness is part of what we look for. Most islands are well built so that really isn’t an issue.

    I think that’s what needs to be done. Building something that has never been done or has ever been entered is eye catching.
    And personally I want to encourage people to enter who perhaps only have materials like wood and stone to make something that can win too. We had a player about 6-7 years ago who made the most amazing island from wood.
    That’s how I vote and that’s what I look for. But each staff may think differently.
     
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  7. luka
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    luka macdondalds Moderator Premium

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    Yes. Contestants should be allowed feedback. Once the choice is made there is no turning back. There should be no need for this criticism about who won, the staff team chooses the winner and that's it. This might seem biased because i won the January contest, but u know if I lost, I would get over it and resubmit it next months contest.

    The contest, as Said by frez is a bit of fun. Remember the whole point of this server is making a cool island. Winning a medal is just a bonus of completing this goal. There is plenty of opportunities to showcase islands, and having this medal really means nothing in terms of success or whatever ypu may call it.

    I get people may be upset about who wins because they personally think another island submitted may be better, but this contest has nothing to do with how the game should be played. It's really not that serious... just a bit of fun.
     
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  8. alex : (
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    alex : ( Well-Known Member

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    Personally, I feel like the whole island competition thing is just a disaster in the making. Comparing players' islands to one another will never end with everyone being happy. If a contestant loses, they are obviously going to feel as if they deserve the win.

    Sometimes there is no feedback that is needed to be given to a contestant whos island was not chosen as the winner. I think the only real option for contestants who lost is to change a few things about your island then submit it again next month, and hope you will come out on top.

    but i think omars island was better tbhh:eek::D
     
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  9. Hireath (Astro)
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    Hireath (Astro) Well-Known Member

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    Eh I’m not too sure about the showing how many votes someone got because if someone got none or 1 vote I feel like it would just be depressing to see that and the runner up would probably be in the woulda coulda shoulda mind set if they were a few votes off, of course no one wants to lose but even knowing you have a island that doesn’t look as good doesn’t help seeing how poorly it did maybe just leave it up to the person to ask to see it I guess? ( take this with a grain of salt I didn’t read the thread much )
     
  10. 52Phenomenon
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    52Phenomenon Super Moderator Super Moderator Events Manager

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    Oke good morning guys. I'm just going to try and go through in order each thing that was said in the thread and clear things up etc. Apologies in advance for the length of this and also if my writing is not great; I am aware that I am not always the best at expressing myself through words :')

    This is correct. I think I explained this in game to some players via DM, I'm not sure if it was you when we spoke before but I'll happily explain again for complete transparency. When entries close, I compile a list of every name of every island that has been entered that month. I then personally visit each island in game and I compile some screenshots of the islands to show to the super mods. Because there are often quite a few entries, the super mods then all have a say and wittle them down to what is normally a list of 3 islands. (Even the super mods often have different opinions! This is why we compile a list for the team to vote on.) From there I ask the entire staff team to vote on which island they think should win. Please note that I ask all staff members to personally visit the islands in game if they can when they have some time. But sometimes team members may be busy, so I post screenshots of all the islands in the poll so that they can still have their say even if circumstance prevent them from getting online that day. I'm pretty sure I've explained the entire process there - if you speak to any of the staff on the team I'm sure that they will happily let you know that this is exactly how the winners are decided.
    I'd just like to clear up that this is not what happened. If it is how you interpreted our conversation, I am very sorry if I wasn't clear. According to my recollection of our conversation, you came to me asking for feedback about your island for future reference/entries in the island contests. I politely declined this because, as I explained, I did not (and still do not) believe that it would be fair for me to give one entrant feedback on their island and not the other entrants, as this would be unfair on other people wanting to enter the island contest. I want the contest to be a level playing field, so giving feedback to one entrant in game via DMs would be unfair to other entrants who would not be receiving any. Me giving you feedback in DMs would be unfair to the other entrants, and I stand by my decision to not give you personal feedback in order to remain fair to the other entrants.
    The information which has been included in the island contest threads still stands, I quote directly from those threads here: "Islands will be judged on how unique they are, how well they are built, and their general look." It is also important to note that when I ask staff members to vote for a winner, I reiterate this to them so that they make an informed decision. It is not like the entire team sits together and creates an extensive pros and cons list for each entrant. They just take a look and decide which island they prefer based on the criteria which I set out from the beginning. Each team member's reasoning for picking a certain island to be the winner would differ, and this is totally ok because we all have different eyes, minds and opinions of what we like. For example in the past I have believed that in my eyes, a certain island should win but the team's general consensus was different. I'm ok with this and accept it because I know that my opinion is different. I choose not to question the integrity of the choices that my fellow team members make, because I trust in them 100%. The island contest was never meant to be about improving people's building abilities by giving everyone feedback. It was simply intended to be a bit of a fun to bring the community together, encourage people to enjoy making their island into something special and let people showcase and have fun with their islands. I never stated that feedback would be given and it would actually be quite hard for me to give feedback to every single entrant that has ever and will ever enter a contest. I am busy with school, other IRL issues, trying to moderate in game, run karaoke nights each week (shoutout to my fellow team members who are amazing hosts and help me), run this contest each month, work on new events both on my own and in conjunction with the team and a multitude of other things that go on behind the scenes. I also believe that me giving feedback would result in further issues, a few things that I think of off the top of my head would be some people may believe I am too harsh in feedback, or too nice. Some people may not want feedback because the contest is just a bit of fun, but some people may want extensive feedback. Some people would want it shorter, some people would want it longer, some people would try to get more feedback from me in game (which like I discussed above is unfair) along with many more issues.
    Please see my comments above about this conversation that we had :)
    Nothing needs to change about your island for you to be able to re-enter it, I'm not really sure where you got this idea. I hope she doesn't mind me using her as an example but take this month's contest winner Mai . I'm pretty sure she had entered the contest previously but she was still able to win this month and I don't think she drastically changed anything. You are free to re-enter your island as many times as you'd like but as I have explained from the beginning, creating a new island each time you enter is more likely to lead to a win.
    Again see above where I talked about this.
    I am very happy to speak to anyone in DMs who has questions or concerns about the island contest. Like I say in the threads each month, you guys can feel free to message me on discord (52Phenomenon#9268 is my tag!) or DM me whenever you catch me in game.
    This is just your opinion though. And perhaps it is shared by some others, but opinions are subjective. Your opinion of the best island will differ from mine, which will differ from other people's. Like I've said, each staff member will have a slightly different view of what they like and this is fine. If everyone in the world had the same opinion of everything and saw things through the same pair of eyes, the world may be a very bland and boring place.
    I completely agree with this comment here. This contest was just a bit of fun that I planned because I thought the community would enjoy a monthly event that everyone could take part in. As far as I was aware, the community was still enjoying it. This thread was genuinely a complete shock to me.
    Thanks for your input. I understand where you're coming from with this comment but this competition was never menat to be about pitting players against each other. I would like to apologise to you and any other player's that may be thinking the same thing if you guys think that this contest is to pit players against each other, it was most definitely not my intention. As I'm sure some of the team would tell you, this contest was intended to bring the community together and just have a bit fun. I would really like to emphasise the word fun throughout this because it really was the main, clear intention; to let you guys have fun.
    Like I've said everyone has different opinions and this ok, some people may agree with you and some people may disagree. I respect your opinion and I'm sure you can understand that despite this being your opinion, you can see why others may have (and are entitled to) a different one.

    FlamingTrees I saw that you added some feedback to but it is getting very close to my next lesson so I hope it is ok that I get to your responses later!

    Like I say I have to get going now, this response took me a little longer than I anticipated haha. Let me know if there's any issues :)
     
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  11. Rolly
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    Rolly Senior Member

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    Island competition is just a side thing the server is doing.

    Giving feedback to every island submitted would take too long and wouldn’t be accurate since mr. X ( the owner of the island ) likes it the way it is but mr. Y ( the judge ) doesn’t.
     
  12. eunice
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    eunice epiphany Premium

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    I can definitely see where you are coming from, and I definitely support the idea of having more transparency between staff and players, but this should be done on a basis without the assumptions that are being made.

    Like 52 had mentioned, it would definitely be unfair if one entrant got personal feedback and others didn't. But all in all, I personally don't think that "feedback" would be a viable option regardless because at the end of the day this is very subjective and there will always be a sense of "bias" like you've mentioned- whether it be "friend bias" or just "preference bias" in terms of aesthetics all in all. It feels like people are taking this competition very seriously- which is understandable, I get that we are all competitive in our own ways. But again, there really is nothing as personal to it as it's been make out to be- at least for the island comp. Staff simply take a few minutes of their time to vote on a poll.

    The purpose of this island competition is supposed to be fun and exciting for players to possible win something but at the same time show off their island to the community. It feels as though the fun has been drained out of the competition. We all have our different sense of aesthetic and what appeals to us. And our differences in opinions and all is what allows us to harmonise with each other and admire each others' builds.

    Anyways these are just my opinions. But what I'm trying to say is that, I hope that people don't continue to take this event in a negative light. It's okay to be competitive because again, who isn't. But don't just have your mind set on competing & winning, also try to have fun, appreciate other's builds, as well as be proud of your own builds and all in all just enjoy the moments of building up an island : )
     
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    Last edited: Mar 2, 2021
  13. OmarsCraft
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    OmarsCraft Active Member

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    I love seeing this
    I'll be replying to this later either here or through DMs since I'm still a bit sleepy :p (after typing the rest below this I will be sharing a few ideas and suggestions in DMs;))
    But I think the kind of reply Borahae left is more than enough to go off of and would be nice if Staff Members could share their input on what they take into consideration when going through islands in the competition so us builders have a lil to go off of :) these types of replies can be left in a thread that future and past contestants can come to so they can see what different Staff members base their judging off of :grin:
    I myself am an extremely competitive person with almost everything I do so I might do or say a couple things that come off as aggressive which isn't ever my overall intention and I'm sorry if anything I've said up to this point came off that way and thats to any and all Staff Members and fellow Contestants that have read this thread :D
     
  14. 52Phenomenon
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    52Phenomenon Super Moderator Super Moderator Events Manager

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    Ok I'm back! Nothing major to add just to address some things that I didn't manage to get to yesterday. Off we go :)

    I can really see where you're coming from with this idea but the only problem with it is that it would kind of create a ranking of sorts, which I really want to try and avoid. Like I said I always intended for the contest to just be a bit of fun to bring the community together; I think publishing exact numbers and rankings of where certain player's islands 'finished', so to say, diminishes some of the light-hearted spirit of the competition and might even create more issues if some players (due to their own personal opinion which like I've said, they are free to have) completely disagree with such a 'ranking'.
    This is a good point here; I never want to make anyone feel bad about their build as I, and I'm sure the entire team and all of you guys too, really appreciate anyone just taking the time to build and enter an island, even if it doesn't end up winning.
    I think just comes back to what I said above about creating a kind of ranking which I would like to avoid. I think I said it in my other reply, that this contest was never and still isn't intended to pit you guys against each other, so I really want to work hard to ensure that it never feels like this.
    Thank you also for your thoughts :)
    I agree with what Rolly and Eunice have mentioned here and think they're key things to keep in mind!
    This was worded very well by Eunice and its definitely a good way of putting it; I can of course understand competitiveness but I just hope that you guys can enjoy the competition for what it is, just a bit of fun and community involvement :)
    Just to let the people know reading this thread that me and Omar did end up talking in DMs, I'm not ignoring his reply here or anything :)

    Anyways, I think that's it from me. I know this reply didn't add too much to my original reply, I just wanted to make sure I didn't leave anyone's replies out. FlamingTrees sorry it took me a bit longer to get to your reply than I'd hoped! I hope I've managed to clear up most things that were brought up here. Like I've said I'm always happy to talk to anyone with a question, concern or if you just want to talk to me about the contest. I'm in game most days where you can shoot me a DM or you can reach me on discord @ 52Phenomenon#9268. And of course you can chat to me about any of the server's events! I'm also pretty much always working on or brainstorming new events ideas! ;) It's a pleasure to see you guys taking part in any of the server's events and I hope that you guys continue to enjoy attending and taking part in them, as I have a great time planning and hosting them, and alongside my teammamtes. Have a nice day guys :)
     
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