Accepted Griefing[Accepted]

Discussion in 'Appeals Archive' started by Louiemar, Jul 11, 2020.

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  1. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    1. Your banned account name: Louiemar
    2. Server you were banned on: Skyblock survival
    3. Ban message/reason: Griefing
    4. Have you read the rules? Yes.
    5. Do you think this ban was incorrect? Yes, Explain below.
    6. Please list any other times you have been banned on any of our platforms: Island farming, Duping.
    7. Why would you like to be unbanned? I gave nighteh around 13 easter basket about 2 months ago as a gift however if she ever quit i will take my easter basket back. So when she didn't log on for months i assume she quit. I took all my easter basket as a result. I under stand it may look like i stole them but i original gave it to her. But i also took couple items which is wrong but can be returned. Im not looking for my 31 days to be completely removed, More so a reduction of my punishment. I shouldn't have stolen the other items but the easter baskets were originally mine.
    8. If you know, tag the member of staff that banned you: iballisticbunny6 Agent
    9. Do you understand and accept our rules and code of conduct? Yes.
     
  2. iballisticbunny6
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    iballisticbunny6 Senior Member

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    Sorry about the delay. I’m working on a response and I’ll get back to you once I’m done with work.
     
  3. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    Don't really need to rush i can keep up the banned im not really gonna do anything else on skyblock for now. take your time.
     
  4. iballisticbunny6
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    iballisticbunny6 Senior Member

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    Alright. So, talking to Nighteh/alissa contacted me and was very confused and hurt that you took the heads that were given to her as a gift. Why did you take them? Even if she quit, why would you take back a gift from someone? Did you attempt to contact her at all?

    Like I stated earlier, if the heads were a gift, why would it be ok to take them back? For example, say you got a friend a nice gift for their birthday, but decided to take it back right under their nose. The friend would be angry because that was a kind gesture and gift to them, and the theft of it makes you bad in their books.

    You're a very active player, so I assume you know the rules by know, especially theft. Why did you take them? For profit? Speaking of which, where did you place those heads? Looking through the logs, it appeared that you took 12 heads from Nighteh's island, then placed them on your island, and then broke them afterward, with no trace after that. Where did they go?

    I'll leave you with those questions for now, the next post after you respond will be a reflection on how this affects the community and those around you.
     
  5. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for replying back.
     
  6. iballisticbunny6
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    iballisticbunny6 Senior Member

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    Louiemar would you like to continue with the appeal? You've been active on both the forums and Discord server. If no response in regards to furthering the appeal is given, I'll lock this up in 48 hours.
     
  7. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    I would but i don't think i got anymore responses.
     
  8. iballisticbunny6
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    iballisticbunny6 Senior Member

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    I understand that we worked out some of the appeal over discord, but you really didn't answer any of the questions from my initial response, and from your tone and behavior over discord, you didn't seem very remorseful, nor did you want to return to the community. Since that time, you've rejoined the discord, so why? The lack of remorse doesn't show me that you regret your actions or show me that something like this won't happen again.
     
  9. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    When I gave Alissa the gift, I made it clear there were strings attached. If she quit, I would take it back. It was not a traditional gift as you say above. I took a 2 day break from skyblock because i was placing too much time into it. I was not properly interacting with my family and now have made measures to change that. I have a limit of the amount of time i play now so i can help out around the house. I needed to take a break to clear my mind and put family first and i rejoined the discord to say hi to my friends, because ive made really good friends here. I love this community and do want to come back thats why i rejoined the discord. I am remorseful for stealing what was not mine, Me and alissa were good friends, we would just take items back and forth freely. I had poor judgement when taking the easter baskets. I understand the rules and i promise you i wont do it again. This is my first appeal for looting so its not like i have a previous record. Next time i make a deal like this ill get proof so i dont fall into the same mistake again.
    I am sorry to alissa for taking her items and i think ive proved my remorse by paying her back. I hope this is enough to proof that i am actually sorry and want to be back in the community.

    thank you for your time.
     
  10. iballisticbunny6
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    iballisticbunny6 Senior Member

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    We covered this already. A gift is a gift, and without notifying the other party is theft and she most obviously didn’t know about the “strings attached.”

    A 2 day break from skyblock is a bit of time to reflect, but you talked to me as if you were planning on leaving forever. These quick decisions and change in behavior lead me to think that you definitely need time to come to a solid decision on how you want to be in the community.
     
  11. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    I have explained myself above, i dont know what else you would like me to say. Im sorry that you don't believe my words but thats all i can give you. I can not be responsible for alissa not remembering our terms but i have already accepted what has happened and paid her back, which i think shown my remorse for taking it. i was initially dramatic because my father was very strict on me and i believed i would not be able to come back, but i have talked with him and as long as i watch my time on the computer i will be allowed to play. So thats why it sounded like i wouldnt come back.
     
  12. iballisticbunny6
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    iballisticbunny6 Senior Member

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    I can see that you're remorseful, but yet still, you seem to make decisions very quickly, as shown with the reason for the ban and your quick decision to quit and then rejoin the community.

    I'll think about shortening your ban.
     
  13. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    I think ive explained as much as i can about my quick decision.

    Thank you for considering shortening my ban
     
  14. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    Is there any update, normally appeals are denied if inactive after 3 days, I feel like you are focusing on stuff that is not related to my ban so what if i left the server and came back i made a decision and took it back, i have already assumed responsibility for it. So im asking to be unbanned i have served nearly half of my punishment, while making amends for what ive done. I dont think its fair for you to judge me for decisions that have nothing to do with me griefing alissa. it seems as if you are treating this appeal as a judgement on my character rather than on my actions and ive shown to be remorseful which you have admitted, is that not enough? judging from previous threads why can i not be unbanned.

    Accepted - [blinkblinks] Stealing [Kerahna] [Accepted] | Skyblock Forums
    this player was unbanned on the same day for returning the items. i cant return items but i repayed her and i have served 10 days.

    in this appeal the player has stolen over 10 thousand items and was unbanned in the same day.
    Accepted - [BennyDonut] Major Looting [michael1234] [Accepted] | Skyblock Forums

    in this thread the player shows remorse and was banned for 13 days. her ban was shortened after 2 days of consideration. she waited less time than me.
    Accepted - [PLE_Beautiz_xX] Major Griefing [Blyx][Accepted] | Skyblock Forums

    in this thread the player has a significantly worse ban history than me, however was still unbanned in the same day.
    Accepted - [JuztAndy] Looting [Bossyy] [Accepted] | Skyblock Forums

    final one, this player was unbanned in the same day she stole illegal items and was unbanned in 2 days.
    Accepted - Snoopytoy/Extreme Looting/Talia[Accepted] | Skyblock Forums

    So going from previous precedent, why am i being judged for making a single rash decision. It doesnt seem fair that i have to justify a choice that has nothing to do with my ban appeal. Me leaving skyblock is not related to me looting alissa. i am truly sorry for stealing.

    Thank you for your time.
     
  15. iballisticbunny6
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    iballisticbunny6 Senior Member

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    I've been working every day for the past few days, so I haven't had a lot of time to think about this. My apologies for that. I understand that you made amends but the whole point of this ban appeal was to judge your character and what happened in order to see whether or not you are ready to reenter the community. Also, the other threads involve people who are not you and I am not the people who banned/unbanned them. Ultimately I have the final decision and you rushing me won't get it done any faster. In fact, it has only been 9 days since your initial ban. So allow me that time to think and I'll get back to you in time. I have other responsibilities besides your singular ban. Please understand this. Thank you.
     
  16. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    I didnt mean to rush you, im just asking for more information i understand that im not your only ban and you have other responsibilities. But for me skyblock is a big part of my life and i would like to play. I dont know why my character is being judged when it has nothing to do with my appeal. But if that is how you would like to judge me thats fine. Are you saying that there is no structure to the appeal process and if you felt like it, even if i had given perfect answers to all your questions, you would still be able to keep me banned for the entire duration?. Is there no rules to the act of appealing/moderating? Im not attacking you or anything im just asking for a simple update. I feel like there should be a certain standard upheld and it's unfair for me to go 3 days with no update or anything of the sort. I just used the same logic applied for players that do not reply to their appeals in 3 days. I dont think its ridiculous for me to expect any sort of update. Im sorry if it seemed as if i was attacking you. its fair for me to draw comparisons from other appeals/bans because without those there would be no structure to the appeal process.

    in this thread the player lies about griefing and was unbanned in the same day. I've proven that im sorry for my actions yet my punishment is much more severe.
    Accepted - skyblock.net ciel_means_sky stealing diamonds iballisticbunny6[Accepted] | Skyblock Forums

    I would have used more examples of your threads but i dont think you dealt with much looted when you were a moderator previously so i cant draw any comparisons. I have not used this thread because the player ban evaded and refused to comply which i havent done.
    Accepted - [ZHENAYETi] Theft [Bunny][Accepted] | Skyblock Forums

    Im just asking for some consistency, i made a rash decision and shown why i did that. Yet it seems that, that decision is worth dragging out my appeal to 10 days. Im not attacking you, just looking for some perspective.

    Thanks again for your time.
     
  17. RedstoneTrails
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    RedstoneTrails Moderator Moderator

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    There are some standards to the appeal process and overall punishments, but there are no blanket rules. Every case is different. Staff need to take into consideration many variables with a situation, including a player's history, perceived intentions of the rule broken, and the player's response to the ban. Bringing up other player's bans and unbans, as well as the manor in which the staff responsible handle the bans, just distracts from the main concerns. Every ban is unique, and therefor cannot be compared to other situations.

    Your character is brought into question as you've been on the server for quite a while now, and should understand the rules, as well as how to interact with others on the server.

    The appeal is left up, even after time with no replies, as we don't want to see players be banned. Banning someone is never a pleasant experience, and we don't want to see dedicated members of the community remaining banned for extended periods of time. However, we do want to make sure you fully understand that actions have consequences, and that you're truly committed to being the best you you can be when you join back into the server.

    Staff cannot always give immediate replies to appeals, and lack of replies should never be seen as a bad thing. Some choices take time to consider, while other times staff may have other pressing issues, whether server related, or in the real world. We just want the best for you, and do not want to see repeats of similar situations in the future. I'm sure you have a lot of friends on the server and have made many connections over this year, which makes it all the more possible that you'll run into situations later on where people you are friends with go inactive for many months.

    All we ask is that you remain patient throughout the appeals process. Instead of using that time to try and compare your situation to others, use it to reflect on your own actions and how things you do can hurt others. You have taken some ownership for what you did, but a lot of it was laced in malice towards Bunny, as well as some of the blame being deflected. Even if you had made a prior agreement with Nighteh about retrieving the heads when they quit, you had never confirmed with them that they truly had quit, and instead just assumed that they had due to inactivity.

    In the end, it all just comes down to respect. Seeing you show respect to all members of the server, whether they're a new player, friend, or staff member. Things only flow smoothly when everyone shows respect for each other. Taking things without consent from Nighteh shows a lack of respect for a friend, and attacking the choices made by Bunny show a lack of respect towards staff.

    I won't comment anymore on the matter. I hope you don't take any of this as hurtful Louie, but instead as just overall feedback to help you improve.
     
  18. Krissy
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    Krissy hyyh Administrator Discord Administrator Premium Premium

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  19. Louiemar
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    Louiemar Well-Known Member

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    Sorry for the late reply, I wanted to properly formulate my thoughts without coming across with this so called malice you keep pushing onto me. I believe i've kept my responses and replies civil and don't see how they can be misconstrued as malicious or disrespectful in any sense.

    Thank you for this information, now lets look at these few requirements that you've mentioned. History: I have a history of a single ban, griefing/dupings handled by cyk shown here: Accepted - [Louiemar] Island Farming/Duping [cyk753][Accepted] | Skyblock Forums

    I was unbanned in 3 days. In-game I will admit I have been muted and warned, but none of this history is related to griefing or looting. The intentions were clear i wanted the items so i stole them. I believed they were mine because of the clause I gave alissa and have admitted I was wrong. My response to the ban is clear i am remorseful and have proved my remorse by paying alissa back the grass i made from her items. That is all i can do to show my remorse and i have shown im sorry by being open throughout this appeal. i haven't acted out in any way because of the ban, I have not ban evaded or done anything to disrespect bunny because of the ban.

    Can you explain to me what the main concern is?
    To me, the main concern is me looting alissa and stealing from her. Once again I can not take back what has been done and accordingly paid her back her items. Since my appeal is the main concern in this case, I am proving why I should be unbanned. Yes every case is unique but there are always a few underlying similarities among every appeal. It is wrong for you to say that I can not compare my case with the other players' threads I have shown. It is fair to compare appeals to get perspective when I can not get any from the comments above. Lets use real world logic, like laws, They set previous precedents through cases and apply the base rulings to each case even though each case can be wildly different there a still constants. So i dont know why you dismiss what ive said before with a simple 2 lines instead of properly disconstructing why i cant use this to back my appeal. The entire purpose of an appeal is to prove why i should be unbanned, is it not? so why can i not use what i have available to prove to you why i should be unbanned.

    I understand the rules and I understand that I broke them. I know I shouldn't have and that's why I am trying to show that I am sorry through not just my words but my actions.

    Why is me asking for a reply after 3 days such an issue? Since bunny had given me no update after 3 full days, I replied once again trying to plead my case. The purpose of a ban appeal is to prove why I should be unbanned. I asked for a reply because it seemed bunny was unsure of my result. I simply applied the same 3 day logic that moderators apply to appeals. It is not as if bunny has to collect more evidence to evict me, I would understand but that is not the case. Everything is open and I've been compliant. Please do not lie to me about Bunny not having the time. I have asked my friends that can still access the server and she has spent at least 3 hours (with breaks) on the server itself and I commonly see her online on the forums. It's not fair to state that there was no time to even consider my appeal when I have seen her on for multiple hours just on the forums. It had been 3 full days when I tried to plead my case again. I didn't ask for an immediate reply, I don't see where you are getting that idea.I would understand you not wanting similar repeats of this situation in the future if this was the 2nd time I have griefed but it's not, it's my first time committing an offence like this. The comment about my friends going inactive has nothing to do with the appeal, I don't know what you are trying to say, I'm sorry.

    I don't know how me waiting 3 days to ask for a response is not patient. Appeals are denied if the appealer doesn't reply in 3 days, so why can't I ask the same for me especially when it's a simple case that does not require anymore investigation. If you are going to accuse me of being malice towards a staff member, please back up accordingly because it is wrong for you to blame me for something that has not happened. I have remained civil throughout this appeal, there is no name calling, no rude language or anything of the sort. I am being respectful yet it seems that I am being talked down to just because I have responded in a way defending why I should be unbanned. I have not taken "some" ownership, I have fully taken ownership. I paid her back with what I could. I can not return the heads. I have already said this. I paid back the money I have stolen. I have already mentioned it is not a gift, yet you keep pushing it. It was not a gift, it was an agreement and the clause was that if she would quit I would take it back. It was not a gift, I just use gift as it is easier to explain. I have accepted the fact that it was my fault for that gathering proper proof of the agreement and I admit that I should have checked if she actually quit. I don't know where you get this idea of malice and blame shifting. I will say it once again, I am sorry to Alissa and the server for stealing from her and breaking the rules. It is my fault for not getting proper proof of the agreement and stealing the items as a result.

    You are right, I did not respect Alissa by taking her items without telling her or her permission. It was wrong of me to do that, I shouldn't have disrespected her as a friend. If you read my previous posts, I stated I was not attacking Bunny multiple times. I did not insult her or demean her in anyway. I asked questions to gain perspective, it is not rude to ask questions. I wanted a reason why I was still banned after nearly half my ban time. It is ridiculous for you to say I was attacking Bunny, there was no ill-intention in my posts. I asked a question and backed up my response to prove why I should be unbanned. So it is extremely unfair of you to say that I was attacking Bunny when it was purely civil and a discussion.

    Thank you for your reply, but can I ask why reply if you are not going to enter into a discussion? It seems unfair for you to say your piece and then leave me to have to once again defend myself. It is unfair to say I was rude and disrespectful to staff, when it's not the case at all. I have acted out of good faith and kept all discussion civil so I don't appreciate the slight comments about improving myself, when I have admitted fault and taken responsibility for my actions. I once again ask the simple question, why am I being judged for me leaving the server for 2 days. I didn't leave the server breaking a variety of rules, causing havoc to the staff or anyone. I re-entered the community staying integrated through forums and discord while I could not log in-game. I would understand Bunny's difficulty coming to a decision if I had clearly disrespected the server when I left, which I did not. I had personal issues that I had to deal with and I did. It is wrong to judge me for my reasons for leaving especially if I never broke the rules.


    Thank you for your time. I hope we can come to an understanding. I am not attacking either of you, this is just me asking for some clarity on the situation. I want to know why the decision to unban me is so difficult. I hope this post is not misconstrued as malice or anything of the sort.
     
  20. RedstoneTrails
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    At it's core, the appeal is about the griefing. Things got a bit more complicated over time. You initially were not fully replying to questions, and later claimed to be quitting the server. You've explained that situation now, so I don't think that is an issue. Those original complications, however, delayed the process a bit, as it prevented anything from moving forward for a bit.

    Using real world logic, there are still large variations. Two people could commit the same crime, and one could be let off with probation, while the other gets 10 years in prison. Cases still vary heavily given the circumstances, as well as with the judge of the case, in this case the staff member. Things like theft can have extremely different outcomes, so it's difficult to set very specific precedents around it. Providing other people's ban appeals comes off more as attacking the choices made by Bunny, instead of defending your case.

    Asking for a reply is not an issue, but the manor in which you replied was more problematic. A simple "any updates?" would have sufficed fine. The things you said in your initial claim, as well in this message, take a very condescending tone, where it feels you're talking down to Bunny and trying to tell her she's wrong.

    Staff have to balance various things. If they only have a few hours in a day to do server related stuff, they have to decide whether they want to spend their time moderating in-game, hanging around in Discord, or replying to threads and messages on forums (among other things). Where we prioritize our time won't always satisfy everyone. Just because a staff member is in-game doesn't mean they're ignoring an appeal or not thinking about it.

    Going off of forums activity isn't the best. When I'm working, I'll often times leave the forums up in a separate tab. I don't have enough time to fully get into depth on things while working, but I'll still try to reply to some threads or messages with the time I do have. Other staff members most likely have similar situations come up.

    I am not literally saying immediate replies, but more so referring to wanting replies in times you deem appropriate. Again, it is better to just ask for any updates than assuming something else is going on and trying to reply to your assumption.

    What I'm saying is that giving items to players with strings attached is a very common occurrence on the server, and has created a ton of issues over the years. If someone has made this type of deal with one person, there's usually a decent chance they've made similar deals with other people. I'm just saying we want to make sure there's no other issues in the future. Not saying that you have or will, just saying that it is something common that I would like to avoid.

    The three day rule for appeals is in place more so for the sake of the staff members. A player not replying to their appeal after three days is often a decent indicator that they don't care that much about their appeal. This doesn't apply in reverse, as staff members have a duty to reply to their appeals, so you know they'll reply. The appeal process is a privilege, and something not all players get. Staff taking time out of their day to try and help someone isn't something that should be rushed or taken for granted.

    (you then say you aren't attacking her, but I'm not sure how else to interpret this other than an attack)
    These quotes, along with overall bringing up various other cases, come off highly aggressive. You say you aren't attacking her, but bringing up all of the ways you think someone has messed up, comparing them to others, and questioning how they moderate, all come off as attacks.

    Many of the questions asked seem like rhetorical questions that should have clear answers, which you ask anyway to try and attack Bunny. I understand that you may not have had bad intentions, but coming from an outside perspective, it is hard to not take a lot of what you've said then and are saying now as aggressive.

    I did not want to enter a discussion as this is Bunny's appeal, and I have very little involvement in the case. I just wanted to give you an outside perspective from someone just reading through appeals. Again, you can say you acted out of good faith, but it hard to interpret it that way when so much of it seemed aggressive, or highly passive aggressive at the least.

    You are not being judged for leaving the server. That was just a small bit that prolonged some things that I think you are taking as more serious than they were. Originally, you told Bunny you were quitting for good. Shortly after, you told us you would actually be able to come back. Given little context, this can seem a bit suspicious. You explained the situation with your family, though, so all was good.



    We all want the same thing. I just think things are getting misinterpreted as you and others are frustrated with the situation. If you say you have no bad intent, I will take you at your word for that.
     
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